Comments on: It’s Not Voluntary, and It’s Not a Contract

By: Blagnet.net » Yes, it is absolute, and no, it is not debatable

Blagnet.net » Yes, it is absolute, and no, it is not debatable — Thu, 09 Dec 2010 19:35:13 +0000

[...] As good and noble as many of those causes are, there is no cause so noble as to justify violating anyone’s rights to accomplish it. The rights of the one outweigh the needs of the many, and anything else, for that matter. If that is not true, who are you to say which rights of mine shall be ignored and which I shall have the privilege of maintaining? Why must libertarians always defend our person and property against you and not the other way around? Why am I not permitted to demand that you pay for my food, housing, health care, or bank bailout, that you operate your business according to the (lack of) regulations that I want, and that you be subject to the court system that I desire? Because the State says so? The majority voted on it? There’s a social contract? No. That is not acceptable or defensible under any system of logic or morality. Might does not make right, the majority should not rule, and there is no such thing as a social contract. [...]

By: Sovereign Man

Sovereign Man — Tue, 06 Oct 2009 18:41:48 +0000

Citizenship is voluntary and must be done with full knowledge and intent.

One can not be born in any state, as a state is only an artificial claim to jurisdiction.
One has no memory of birth nor any knowledge of circumstances surrounding it. (i.e. Birth Certificate)
One has only the authority of man and any proclaimed authority greater then the one is fictional.

A name is an artificial designation given to property by the owner thereof.
Do you have any owner?
Have you been using a name? (registered freely at ones supposed birth and given to the government freely and willingly by uninformed parents)

Using someone else's property without consent is trespass.
Did you ask for consent to use said property. (i.e. Name)
Do you continue to use said property? Why?

By: nothirdsolution

nothirdsolution — Thu, 24 Sep 2009 22:33:40 +0000

the government owns every single inch of land in the USA. They enforce their domination of the land by force. If you don’t think that this fact of life is “fair” or “right”, tough; they have men with Darth Vader outfits and M4s standing by. Not much you can do about that.

That's a charmingly defeatist attitude.

You are half correct though, governments take a lot from us, but it is all done by consent.

It's not consent because A) most people were never given a "choice" and B) even if they were, the decision was made under duress (i.e., threat of violence).

Go troll somewhere else.

By: nothirdsolution

nothirdsolution — Thu, 24 Sep 2009 22:32:12 +0000

But you will not be liable for the income tax if you don’t have a taxpayer identification number (SSN)

Wrong. You can't renounce an SSN. I've inquired.

The fact that you (probably) have a birth certificate,

Is merely evidence of when and where I was born (and to whom).

The Amish do, and so can you.

The amish do not live outside of the vast majority of these "contracts". Do your homework.

By: Mike

Mike — Thu, 24 Sep 2009 20:43:21 +0000

“csun” is spot on about how the property tax is prima fascia evidence that the government owns every single inch of land in the USA. They enforce their domination of the land by force. If you don’t think that this fact of life is “fair” or “right”, tough; they have men with Darth Vader outfits and M4s standing by. Not much you can do about that.

You are half correct though, governments take a lot from us, but it is all done by consent. Income tax is voluntary, you agree to it by getting a SSN and earning wages in the form of Federal Reserve notes. Trade your labor for property. Fed notes are not property; they are an obligation of the Federal Reserve. It is like going to Disney Land, buying Disney dollars and then complaining about the terms, conditions and restrictions of their currency. While it will prove to be more difficult to buy stuff at Disney Land with gold and silver, you will not be required to play by Disney Land’s rules. When you use their dollars you consent to their rules; the reason you consent is for the convenience their currency provides you. You can either have convenience or freedom, take your pick.

By: Mike

Mike — Thu, 24 Sep 2009 20:42:52 +0000

It is a contract. You signed up for this contract when you became a citizen. Don’t remember doing that? Your parents must have done it for you then. Feel free to renounce your citizenship and become a denizen. You won’t be able to do a number of things a citizen can do: vote, get a social security number, get a regular job, etc. But you will not be liable for the income tax if you don’t have a taxpayer identification number (SSN) and you buy, sell and trade with anything besides Federal Reserve notes (gold and silver maybe). The fact that you (probably) have a birth certificate, citizenship, a SSN, and numerous other licenses prove that you have agreed to abide by all the rules and regulations of these contracts. If you don’t agree with the rules set forth by these various contracts then why don’t you renounce them and live your life without them. The Amish do, and so can you.

By: firstorb

firstorb — Mon, 12 Jan 2009 19:15:36 +0000

although i do believe that our countrys government is somewhat of a joke where actors and wrestlers can become government officials (not to mention t19 and social security is a joke). i will not pretend to be educated enough to be able to side either way on your argument. but i will say you do make some strong points. kudos to you.

By: no third solution » Blog Archive » Property Taxes are NOT “Rent”

Sat, 06 Dec 2008 22:54:49 +0000

[...] let’s think of it as rent A non-negotiable rent. Backed by the “social contract, so-called, a complete fiction which no man ever accepted because it was never lawfully offered, [...]

By: Francois Tremblay

Francois Tremblay — Wed, 23 Jul 2008 19:49:37 +0000

My answer would have been

“I don’t know who you’re trying to fool, midwesterner, me or yourself, but you’re no Anarchist. And you are insane if you believe that a piece of paper protects you from anything.”

By: csun

csun — Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:23:27 +0000

I rent my property by the year from my county government and each year the rent goes up without any input from me.
If I refuse to “opt out” by not paying my rent i.e property tax,I will be kicked off my land and it will be sold on the courthouse square to the highest bidder.
It makes absolutely no difference whether I can afford the rent or not, if I don’t pay I will get the boot from the benevolent overlord.
We are all serfs renting our freedom by the year from a collectivist government.
We can never own property free and clear of the threat of seizure by a fiscally irresponsible and corrupt government.
On the right we’ve brain dead denizens proclaiming”support the troops” and on the left we’ve doubly indifferent morons screaming “Bush lied , people died.”
The show goes on and the rent is always due.